Melanie C On Politically Incorrect Transcript- 1/13/00
Black Text = Everyone Else
Blue Text = Melanie C
Bill: All right.
Let's meet our panel.
I can tell there's going to be a lot of screaming at these intros.
The band is Savage Garden.
The CD is "Affirmation."
He is Darren Hayes.
[ Screams and applause ]
I told you.
How're you doin'?
Okay.
He is the man behind the hit CD "I Want It All" and the man in
front of millions as a presenter this week for the American
Music Awards on Monday, Warren G.!
[ Cheers and applause ]
Hey, Warren.
How you doing?
Good to see you.
One of the infinitely popular Spice Girls, her new solo CD is
called "Northern Star."
She's sporty, she's spicy, she's Melanie C.!
[ Screams and applause ]
Melanie C. right over here.
How're you doin'?
Melanie: Good, thank you.
Bill: and he is the star of "Winning Lines," the producer of
"Greed" and the host of the American Music Awards this Monday at
8:00 right here on ABC.
The very rockin' Dick Clark, ladies and gentlemen.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Dick, How are you?
All right.
Okay.
Dick: Did you say "Host of the American Music Awards"?
Bill: No.
Producer.
Dick: Thank you.
It's Norm McDonald.
Bill: You're not getting senile on us, Dick.
[ Laughter ]
You're still young.
Come on.
They were still screaming for you.
Dick: But stop.
You and I are the only ones in suits.
Bill: Yeah, well --
[ Laughter ]
We're the only ones who've seen 30.
Okay, Dick, let's get real about this.
And I want to talk about this, because, you know, the other day,
this week, the postmaster general put out a stamp honoring hip-hop.
Do you know this?
They're honoring the '80s.
They have a series of 15 stamps.
Things like "E.T." is going to be on a stamp.
"The Cosby Show."
"Cats" the musical.
Please, I don't want to lick that.
[ Laughter ]
Cabbage Patch Kids.
And they're doing a hip-hop stamp.
It features a ho backing her ass up.
[ Laughter ]
[ Applause ]
We get to vote for the young ho or the old fat ho.
[ Laughter ]
No.
I have two questions.
Do you think it's appropriate?
And, two, do you think the Postmaster-General, if he had any idea
what hip-hop lyrics really were about, would put it on a stamp?
Darren: But Elvis Presley's on a stamp, right?
Bill: Elvis Presley didn't sing the kind of lyrics that are in
rap music.
Darren: -- Pretty rebellious stuff.
Dick: Are you're mixing up rap and hip-hop, though?
Bill: Maybe.
Dick: Isn't there a difference?
Warren: I mean, hip-hop is hip-hop.
Hip-hop is hip-hop.
Bill: There is no difference.
Dick: There isn't any difference?
Melanie: No, I think -- I mean all the subjects you're talking
about in the '80s, I think hip-hop is probably more important to
me and to the nation.
Cabbage Patch Kids.
You know what I mean?
They're saying, it's a celebration of music, it's an expression
of how life is to some people.
Do you know what I mean?
Warren: A lot of young people.
Bill: We're talking about a stamp, Mel.
Melanie: But what I'm saying is it's got more -- I still think
it's more important to celebrate something like that.
Warren: Yeah.
Darren: I come from a country where we put roses on stamps, you know?
So hip-hop's a bit more interesting than that.
Bill: A bit more interesting, but I don't know why we have to
use stamps.
I mean, would you put it on a stamp in England?
[ Speaking at once ]
Dick: It's a huge influence in today's society.
Why shouldn't it be recognized?
Bill: Recognized?
Well I don't think breast cancer should be on a stamp either.
First of all, I don't think stamps should be used to tell our messages.
They should be used to send our letters for those of us who are
not using E-mail.
[ Applause ]
Melanie: No, I completely disagree.
Because I'm glad to mention something like breast cancer.
Something like a stamp can bring awareness.
And if you could use something like that --
[ Cheers and applause ]
And hip-hop is bringing awareness to how life is on the street.
And if people want to deny --
Bill: Oh, please.
Melanie: No?
Warren: Hip-hop, it's a way of life.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Bill: It's all about thuggery and misogyny.
Warren: No, no.
You got it twisted.
Bill: 90% of it is about shooting and treating women in a way
that's -- what?
Warren: Hip-hop does not make people go out there and shoot people.
People do what they want.
Bill: I didn't say that.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Warren: No, but you're saying it's thuggery.
Bill: But I tell you, people listen to hip-hop.
If they did, if white people actually did, older white people,
they would think that every black person in this country lives in
the ghetto, shoots people and thinks women are bitches and hos.
[ Laughter ]
Melanie: But not all hip-hop says that.
Not all hip-hop.
Bill: No, not all.
But so much of it that black people I know are tired of it.
They're like, "would you represent my life?"
I don't call women "hos."
Melanie: No, I think you're right.
The glorification of things like that, you know, is not too cool.
But you've got to --
Warren: That's why they put "explicit lyrics" on the CD.
If you know it's on there, don't listen to it.
Darren: It's just a stamp.
I send an E-mail.
Dick: A stamp is like a horse and buggy.
It ain't going to be around but for another ten minutes anyway.
They got to figure out a way to sell them.
Darren: I think the average person sends three E-mails or four
E-mails for every actual postage stamp.
Bill: I think you should be on a stamp.
Talk about an American --
[ Cheers and applause ]
No, I mean, really.
And then, we could vote for the young Dick or the old Dick.
[ Laughter ]
All right.
We got to take a break.
We'll be right back.
Bill: All right.
First of all, Dick, it is I who am going senile.
I did say you're hosting, and you're not, you're producing.
Norm is hosting.
Okay, I want to talk about this issue that
came up recently, because I know there was
a poll in England that said a lot of people think that rock stars
are responsible for kids doing drugs, which may or may not be true.
In this country now, we have a new drug test kit that is
available.
It's like a home pregnancy kit.
For parents.
If they want to find out if that ashen-faced zombie --
[ Laughter ]
Is he going through a phase or is he going through an eight ball.
[ Laughter ]
They want to know this.
And I think anyone who watches this show knows I have pretty
strong Libertarian credentials about what I think about the drug
issue, but I also think kids are not adults, they don't have the
same rights as adults.
I think the sooner we can get kids out of the equation, the
sooner we can have a real debate about drugs, and that's why I
think it's okay for parents to drug test their kids.
Kids should not be doing drugs.
Darren: That scares me.
I'll tell you why.
Because, look, I was a teacher before I got into this.
Bill: Really?
Darren: I really believe that when you're parenting, I think
that you have to trust children.
Look, I'm very publicly against drugs.
I've never done a drug in my life.
I'm very opposed to them.
But I just think that what you're talking about, policing, I
think that should be left to authorities and to police.
And I think that as a parent, you should have a relationship with
your child that's based on trust and friendship.
And you start introducing that kind of -- to me, that's scary.
That sounds like "The X files" to me.
Melanie: Yeah, but I think, you know, that's great in that
idealistic world.
But a lot of kids do go off the rails, and I think they need to be --
I mean, because drugs are bad news no matter what.
And so to scare them into not doing it.
Any way to get them not to do drugs.
Darren: I think that if you got that serious, that you had to
collect pee samples from your children, I think you should take
them to a clinic, you know?
[ Laughter ]
Melanie: Can you imagine that?
Bill: That's a hard question to ask of a kid.
Dick: Don't you think -- forgetting about invasion of privacy.
I mean, it's an abhorrent thing to have to test your kids.
I mean, you're right, your kids, you should have faith in.
You made a joke out of it.
You see that "ashen-faced kid" lying around in a zombie-like state.
I mean, you can read a book and find out, if you don't know what
drugs do to you.
You can figure it out.
And if you have the least inclination that kid is into it, why
not test them, find out, get them help before they get so far
into it they can't get out?
[ Applause ]
Darren: Is there talking first?
Is there a conversation?
Do we try communicating before we collect pee samples?
Bill: It's America.
We don't know if the kids are building bombs in the garage!
[ Light applause ]
Darren: That's true.
Bill: Yeah.
Warren: You got to trust them.
Darren: That's true.
Warren: You got to trust them.
Dick: But how far?
Warren: If you see 'em walk in
the house stumbling, then you
test them.
Bill: Well, that's what we're talking about.
We're not talking about the straight-A students.
We're talking about the ones who are, you know, looking like
something's going on.
And I don't know.
It's tough, because with teens, something is going on.
They're teenagers.
You know, I mean, they're kind of cuckoo anyway.
[ Laughter ]
Don't you think?
I mean, it's a tough -- what is it?
Warren: Puberty.
Bill: Puberty.
Now, that's a drug you can't be tested for.
[ Laughter ]
All right.
We gotta take a commercial.
We'll be right back.
Announcer: Join us Monday when our guests
will be Eddie Griffin, Layla Ali,
from "Becker," Patty Winston and Bishop Earl Jackson.
[ Applause ]
Bill: All right.
This is really a show celebrating the American Music Awards.
We have three big music stars here.
By the way, one of the great advantages of our job, Dick, is we
get records for free.
[ Laughter ]
By the way, these are all good.
I never pimp something I think is crap.
[ Laughter ]
I listened to all these, and I like them all.
But I want to talk about lyrics, because I have long held that
lyrics are a very, very junior partner in popular music.
And I bet you you're going to disagree.
Melanie: You're a mad man.
Bill: I'm a mad man?
Melanie: Yes.
Bill: I think a great song can have the worst lyrics in the
world, and it will still sell a lot.
And the greatest lyrics in the world cannot move a song that
doesn't move people musically.
Melanie: But you know what?
A song doesn't have to be good to sell, does it?
Bill: No, it doesn't.
[ Applause ]
But generally, I mean, we all agree, I think when people buy
records, you know, you buy what you like.
I don't read record reviews.
That is the best way to have a crappy record collection.
To read the record reviews.
Dick: Let me give you one example.
Because unfortunately you and I totally agree --
Bill: Oh, really?
Dick: -- Because I have no musical talent to begin with, and I
don't write lyrics.
McCartney's original lyrics to "Yesterday" were scrambled eggs.
And then, you heard the song.
But he came with a -- yesterday, bada bada bada.
You always remember -- no, wait a minute.
Bill: If you read that as a poem, and you didn't know that it
was a song.
"Yesterday, all my troubles seem so far away."
You'd go, "oh, please, give me a break.
What trite --"
Melanie: You know, ooh, you're really rattling my cage here.
Ooh, you are.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: well, tell me.
Dick: I'm no longer on your side.
Bill: What?
Melanie: Because it's an individual thing.
But for myself, being a songwriter, you know, the music and the
lyrics go hand in hand.
They both come from the self.
I don't want to sound icky.
But I feel very strongly about this.
Darren: I think a melody is like -- you know when you smell a
perfume it brings you back somewhere, it reminds you of
something.
But I think if the Beatles --
if "Yesterday" didn't say those lyrics, you wouldn't feel
melancholy.
You wouldn't feel wistful, you wouldn't want to be taken back.
I think, as a hip-hop artist, you'll understand that a lot of hip-hop
doesn't have a lot of definable melody.
Doesn't have a lot of definable musicality.
It's mostly percussion.
Bill: That's -- ooh.
Darren: But it's incredible.
Bill: Warren.
[ Laughter ]
Darren: I'm sorry.
No, it's incredible lyricism.
It's incredible statements.
Warren: It's very musical.
Very musical.
Darren: It's musical, but what I'm talking about, it's not
musical in the way that this is being critiqued here, that music
equals melody.
Bill: But it is.
And you know what, I didn't like rap.
Warren: That's what's different about hip-hop.
Darren: It's rhythmic.
Warren: Hip-hop is all of that in one.
Bill: I didn't like hip-hop when it was the way you described it.
When it first came out.
Then they learned, they put in a bass line.
Darren: -- But I think Chuck D is an amazing spokesperson.
Warren: I can't believe y'all.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: I like hip-hop that is musical.
[ Applause ]
Warren: All the hip-hop stars are going to be outside waiting
on y'all after the show.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Bill: Why?
I'm defending it.
Darren: -- Original musical genre in the last 20 years.
I think the last 20 years of music have kind of been crap, to be honest.
Bill: The last 20 years of music have been crap?
Darren: Since rock 'n' roll?
Since rock 'n' roll?
I don't think we've had an original genre since hip-hop.
Bill: That doesn't mean it's crap.
You're right.
Darren: I think that we are constantly regurgitating stuff.
And I think that hip-hop, going back to the statement of do we have
hip-hop on a stamp?
I think it's legitimate in that it's forward-thinking.
Bill: It is.
Darren: That's a new genre of music, and I think it should be
given credit for that.
[ Applause ]
Bill: Right.
It's just different from rock 'n' roll, as when I was a kid, rock
'n' roll was different from what my father listened to, which was
big band music.
Dick: But do you drive along in your car reciting a lyric, or
do you hum a tune?
Bill: I talk on the phone.
[ Laughter ]
Melanie: Do you know what I want you to do?
Bill: What happened?
Melanie: What I would like you to do.
You see my CD's there.
Bill: Yes, I do.
I listened to it.
Melanie: That's why it's still in the wrapper.
Bill: That song about the homeless is very moving.
Melanie: I would like you to listen to it if you have the time.
Bill: I did.
Melanie: And read the lyrics inside, and it might change your mind.
Bill: Okay, but how about your big hit "Wannabe?"
You want to recite the lyric to that?
Melanie: Yeah.
"I'll tell you what I want.
What I really, really want."
[ Cheers and applause ]
Bill: Go ahead.
"I'll tell you what I want, what I really, really want."
Melanie: But, you know, this is Melanie C. as solo artist.
And then, you've got the Spice Girls.
It's a gang of girls who are having fun.
Music is a celebration.
It's emotion.
It takes you places.
[ Screams and applause ]
Bill: Exactly.
Exactly.
And lyrics are cerebral.
And I'm saying that the best lyrics, if they don't have the song,
will not sell.
Otherwise, Tom Waits would be sitting there.
[ Laughter ]
[ Applause ]
Darren: I listen to Carole King.
I listen to James Taylor.
I listen to Bob Dylan.
I think these are incredible singer/songwriters, okay?
I look at the Billboard Hot 100 lately, and I, as a songwriter, I
get completely frustrated that we are buying, by the masses, music
by people who sometimes can't even sing.
It's casted like a Hollywood film.
It's written by someone in a German dance lab, hired by somebody
else to sing it.
And the lyrics don't mean anything.
Warren: I can agree with you on that.
Darren: That frustrates me.
Where's the passion, where's the soul?
If some of those fantastic melodies written by Max Martin who is
writing most of the fantastic pop songs at the moment.
If they meant something, if those lyrics meant something, I would
be happier, and I would go out and buy those records.
But they don't mean anything to me, because the lyrics aren't
saying anything.
Melanie: But you know, music, it covers such a broad spectrum.
You've got throwaway pop.
And then you've got, you know, your deep stuff.
Whatever, you should put it in an individual thing, whatever you choose.
Dick: As the grand old man who has been around since the
beginning of time --
[ Applause ]
Bill: Tell us, tell us, oh, pop god of love.
Dick: This is a dumb argument.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Bill: We've got to take a commercial.
Bill: All right, Monday, we got Eddie Griffin, Layla Ali,
Muhammad's daughter, Bishop Earl Jackson and Patty Wintson.
Don't forget, to tune on Monday night for the AMAs.
We'll all be there.
That's right.
Dick's producing it.
So you know we're all going to be there.
[ Cheers and Applause ]